The metric that is more important than NPS and CSAT - Interview with Shep Hyken artwork
Punk CX with Adrian Swinscoe

The metric that is more important than NPS and CSAT - Interview with Shep Hyken

  • E403
  • 45:50
  • September 22nd 2021

Today’s interview is with Shep Hyken, who is the Chief Amazement Officer of Shepard Presentations and a New York Times and Wall Street Journal bestselling author. Shep joins me today today to talk about his latest book: I’ll Be Back: How to Get Customers to Come Back Again and Again, what an Arnie is, the metric that is more important than NPS and CSAT, the difference between a repeat customer and a loyal customer, where true empathy for the customer starts and if self-service can drive customer loyalty and a whole host of other things.

This interview follows on from my recent interview – We need to start talking about experience leadership – Interview with Peter Cross — and is number 403 in the series of interviews with authors and business leaders that are doing great things, providing valuable insights, helping businesses innovate and delivering great service and experience to both their customers and their employees.

NOTE: A big thank you goes out to the folks at babelforce for sponsoring my podcast this month.


babelforce is the #1 most flexible platform for contact center service. Pierce Buckley, CEO and Co-founder of babelforce, and his team of telecoms veterans have created a powerful cloud communications solution focused on No-Code integration and automation. Their goal is to break down every barrier to great customer experiences by putting intuitive tools in the hands of people who live and breathe CX.

Pierce and Jonathan Baer of Vonage are running a webinar on the 28th October at 11:00am CET and they will be discussing exactly how businesses are getting maximum benefit from WhatsApp, one of the fastest-growing channels for customer service. Follow this link to sign up. You don’t want to miss out as you will get to see a demo of the babelforce platform in action!

Punk CX with Adrian Swinscoe

An ongoing series of interviews where I, Adrian Swinscoe, interview leading entrepreneurs, leaders and thought leaders about how to deliver stand out customer experience and service.

Essentially, I'm looking for practical clues that will help you build a business that both customers and employees love.

Topics covered in the interviews include customer service, experience and engagement, employee experience and engagement, technology, adaptable and responsive organizations, high-performing teams and all such related issues.

Note: This podcast series was originally known as the RARE Business podcast but rebranded in late 2019 on the back of the publication of my latest book: Punk CX.